Form 8891 - Annuitant vs Beneficiary Clarification?

boogens8 · Post by **boogens8** » Thu May 24, 2012 2:20 pm

Hi,

I have an RRSP account through SunLife from my job, and I checked with them and they told me that I am an "annuitant" under the plan.

But, I do see that on previous posts on this forum, there is advice to always use "beneficiary" on the form 8891, so I'm wondering if someone knows the reason to choose "beneficiary" over "annuitant", even if SunLife defines me as "annuitant"?

Do I still get deferral of taxes if I choose "annuitant"? Or what do I gain by choosing "beneficiary" over "annuitant"? I'm curious, because the 8891 instructions state:
"Annuitant. For purposes of this form, an annuitant of an RRSP or RRIF is an individual who is designated pursuant to the RRSP or RRIF as an annuitant and is not also a beneficiary as defined above"

I'm guessing that I may also be defined as a beneficiary according to the IRS, though not according to SunLife, but I'm not entirely sure, so I just am hoping to confirm that I should still use "beneficiary" in my case.

Thanks for the help,
Seth

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Thu May 24, 2012 3:08 pm

The definition in canada for annuitant and beneficary is different than for IRS.

You are a beneficiary of all RRSPs that are under your name.

The best that I can come up with is that you would choose annuitant (and fill in very little of the form) if you were the US citizen funding an RRSP of a non-US citizen spouse AND were reporting the distribution on your return.

makes no sense, so we always use beneficiazry.

http://www.hrinfodesk.com/Articles/fina ... rifwww.htm

boogens8 · Post by **boogens8** » Thu May 24, 2012 6:08 pm

Thank you very much for the reply and information.

Seth

rafa02 · Post by **rafa02** » Sat May 26, 2012 3:26 pm

If part of an RRSP is transferred to a RRIF and then a withdrawal made from the RRIF, would the withdrawal still be considered beneficiary?

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Sat May 26, 2012 3:55 pm

It is always beneficiary.

PLUS you need to determine what amount of the withdrawal is taxable in US.

rafa02 · Post by **rafa02** » Sat May 26, 2012 11:38 pm

Thanks nelsona, yes I previously copied your formula for determining taxable amount, just wanted to verify that it should be "beneficiary". I spoke with a cross border adviser with 30 years experience, earlier this year and he advised me to select annuitant - I know that doesn't surprise you..

tobeagoodman · Post by **tobeagoodman** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:40 am

Hi, nelsona,

I read all post on this thread and still have a little bit confusion. In 8891, if Annuitant is chekced, one need to Complete only lines 7a, 7b, and 8 (Item 5 in the form). Does this mean that if Beneficiary is checked, one has to fill all other items (item 9 and item 10-Undistributed earnings of the plan during the year), after item 8? Thanks!

tobeagoodman · Post by **tobeagoodman** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:43 am

Sorry, I found the answer in the 8891 instruction:

"A beneficiary who previously made the election to defer
income on the plan or is making it initially by checking the
box on line 6c must only complete lines 1 through 8 of the
form."

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 9:41 pm

Just check beneficiary. Period.

Mach7 · Post by **Mach7** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 6:41 am

Nelsona...

I have this same battle with just about every Account every year regarding the 8891. (Canadian preparers)

Of all the IRS forms, this one seems to be pretty straight forward, regardless of the annuitant vs beneficiary definition, if you follow the annuitant box then you would not make the appropriate election for deferral.

Why do these Accountants...who presumably are 'trained' to do US taxes (EIN and PTIN numbers) consistently push you in the direction of 'annuitant'?

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 6:44 am

Why are you bothering with talking to several accts? You basically ask for line by line preparation of your return on this site.