US person in Canada, 14 years, never filed a US return

eortlund · Post by **eortlund** » Thu May 26, 2011 9:23 pm

Even when we renewed my daughter's passport, she had to be seen in person.

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Thu May 26, 2011 9:58 pm

Yeah, your right, kids have to show up.

andsoitgoes · Post by **andsoitgoes** » Thu May 26, 2011 10:31 pm

Damn, I was hoping to prevent having to drag them with us.

But what is the faster procedure? I'm guessing the passport?

But if I get the US passport, will I need to both keep the US and Canadian passports up to date? It's so easy right now, if I got them a passport, it would be simple as can be, but once I get them their US, I assume I'll have to manage both?

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Thu May 26, 2011 10:34 pm

"Manage" is a strong word.

Us citizens entering US are now required to show a US passport when entering, so consider it a requirement.

My son has both, and I was categorically told that he must use a US passport to enter US.

andsoitgoes · Post by **andsoitgoes** » Fri May 27, 2011 12:03 am

The difference is that now all I have to deal with is a Canadian passport.

If I register them a US citizens, then I have to maintain both the US and Canadian passports. Right now, it's half the work.

I already have to manage my Canadian and US cards, guess I'll have to get my butt in gear and do that too. But as of right now, it's just so much easier.

eortlund · Post by **eortlund** » Fri May 27, 2011 1:53 am

Yes, we hope to get Canadian citizenship in the next couple years--it will be a pain handling the two sets of passports. And it's a pain doing two sets of taxes. Just the price we pay for being expats, and the privileges that come from that as well.

andsoitgoes · Post by **andsoitgoes** » Fri May 27, 2011 2:47 am

So what are your thoughts about waiting until I get the SSNs for my daughters? Of course I don't want to keep poking a sleeping bear, but it's been 14 years now..

The only difference will be next year when I do have some US earned income from my freelance work (probably will be under $1500/year) and I'll be getting a W9 as well.

By that point, come what - April, I guess I'll be a blip on the radar, and I'll want to have backfield by then..

Question: Should I file now and then refile when I get my daughter's SSNs?

Or just wait, get them this year, and then submit as soon as I get them?

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Fri May 27, 2011 6:30 am

You need to backfile BEFORE IRS realizes that you have not filed. Otherwise you will be hit with interest and penalties, especially on the foreign account reporting, and RRSPs if you have them.

rlb · Post by **rlb** » Fri May 27, 2011 3:17 pm

Deciding not to get SSN's for your kids is not really an option. Remember that *they* will have to file US tax returns on their world-wide income as soon as they have taxable income, even if they never live in the U.S. For that, they will need SSN's. And they must not travel to the US until they have a US passport - i.e., don't use their Canadian one.

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Fri May 27, 2011 3:20 pm

Exactly.

andsoitgoes · Post by **andsoitgoes** » Fri May 27, 2011 6:05 pm

See, here is where I have a few issues.

At this point, I don't believe my children should have to choose to accept their US citizenship. For all intents and purposes, they were not born in the US, not raised in the US and were born to a Canadian citizen and for that fact, this is where I get defensive and feel that the US has no claim to them.

And if I never get them a US passport, and ONLY get them a Canadian passport, there's no way that they could be considered US citizens.

Anyway, the fact of the matter is that there is no possible or conceivable way I can get them their SSNs for a very long time. Because of my disability, I can't make my way out to Vancouver to sit and wait for them to be seen, and even if I could, I'm unable to book an appointment prior to July even.

So do I wait to get this, or do I file now and then refile when I get their details? This is what I need to know.

And I know it might seem unpatriotic of me, but the fact of the matter is that my children should not be forced to agree to a US citizenship. I am disgusted that it's even handled in that manner.

As of now, I have their Canadian birth certificates and travel across the border with them and have never had an issue, and feel the US has no claim to fight me on that, in my opinion.

andsoitgoes · Post by **andsoitgoes** » Fri May 27, 2011 7:54 pm

So looks like TurboTax back to 2005 is a bust, although I have the program I can't update it, so I'll go from 2010 back and by the time I get to 2005 I should be able to figure it out.

I tell you now, though, this is why I haven't filed for so many years. It's so damn confusing, and it's not like I have hundreds to waste on having an accountant do this.

I know I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but this is a nightmare for me. None of the language is clear, I have no idea if I'm doing it correctly, and I feel simply overwhelmed, frustrated and have half a mind to just throw my hands in the air and give up. I thought the TurboTax program would walk me through it a bit more, but that's even getting beyond me.

So bloody frustrating.

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Fri May 27, 2011 8:15 pm

Your children are US citizens. Pure and simple.

Nothing to accept or reject.

But regardless of what you do for the kids, you do need to file for the last 6 years.

nelsona · Post by **nelsona** » Fri May 27, 2011 8:16 pm

But I sure as heck wouldn't mind collect 6-8K for doing them, like you will.

andsoitgoes · Post by **andsoitgoes** » Fri May 27, 2011 8:21 pm

But how can they be forced to be US citizens? What documents force them into being US citizens?

My issue isn't the money that I can collect from them, it's the issues it forces them into, like I'm dealing with, now. What right does the US have to claim them, just because I fathered them? How is it fair to force them to be subjected to these same tax issues that I have? What if they become incredibly successful and never provide anything to the US, not their presence, etc - they're expected to pay money to a government that has done nothing for them?

Me, although I disagree with it, I understand. But for them, unless they actually took advantage of anything the US has to offer, it disgusts me that they should need to have any requirements to the US govt.

regardless, at this point the way I'm running, this will never get done with how impossible it seems at this point.